WEBVTT 1 00:04:03.980 --> 00:04:05.770 Curtis Phillips: I'll be right back. Everyone 2 00:04:42.740 --> 00:04:50.179 Arnie Espartero: to our program working group meeting. Uh, let's give it a minute or two. See Who else wants to join us. 3 00:05:16.900 --> 00:05:18.380 Lizzie Suh: Hello, everyone! 4 00:05:21.320 --> 00:05:26.230 yvette.brown: Hello, everybody! How's everybody doing? I know. 5 00:05:28.530 --> 00:05:31.849 LISA REES: Let's see. How do we have here? 6 00:05:40.390 --> 00:05:45.660 LISA REES: I'll see if I see for any, as I don't see night. The Nathan, Are you here? 7 00:05:47.170 --> 00:05:49.410 LISA REES: I'm here, Lisa, 8 00:05:51.160 --> 00:05:54.490 LISA REES: Do you have anybody from Dc. 9 00:05:55.590 --> 00:05:58.389 Geraldine Bojarski: Yes, this is Geraldine. I'm here for Vlad today. 10 00:05:58.420 --> 00:06:00.260 LISA REES: Oh, hi, Geraldine, 11 00:06:01.060 --> 00:06:02.590 LISA REES: all right. 12 00:06:04.260 --> 00:06:07.989 LISA REES: Do we have any anybody from Howard's group. 13 00:06:14.090 --> 00:06:15.150 LISA REES: Okay, 14 00:06:17.070 --> 00:06:33.750 LISA REES: all right. Well, let's get started. I I think, before we get started Kurt may have something he wants to discuss, and it may actually pre empt. What our planned discussion was. 15 00:06:33.760 --> 00:06:43.639 Curtis Phillips: We So who is normally here from um Howards whatever they're called now? Not. They're called not nra anymore. What do they call now 16 00:06:44.030 --> 00:06:48.920 Curtis Phillips: who normally comes from? 17 00:06:49.030 --> 00:06:54.100 LISA REES: Um? We've actually not had anybody here in a a meeting or two? 18 00:06:55.570 --> 00:07:00.310 Curtis Phillips: Okay on this name list. Is there a name of someone that normally comes? 19 00:07:00.990 --> 00:07:02.340 Curtis Phillips: Can you scroll 20 00:07:05.390 --> 00:07:08.479 Curtis Phillips: like this, Kelly? Well, and Doesn't come, or 21 00:07:08.510 --> 00:07:12.189 LISA REES: Kelly has not been here in a meeting or two. No, 22 00:07:13.790 --> 00:07:14.830 Curtis Phillips: okay. 23 00:07:15.290 --> 00:07:20.249 Curtis Phillips: Um. We probably should get representation from them. Um, 24 00:07:20.400 --> 00:07:24.590 Curtis Phillips: Nathan, did you get any um? Have you heard anything from them. 25 00:07:28.050 --> 00:07:29.760 Nathan Muzos: I did call and I 26 00:07:30.040 --> 00:07:31.140 emailed. 27 00:07:40.290 --> 00:07:49.810 Curtis Phillips: We probably need to have a We probably need to have this. This is a pretty important discussion, and we probably need to have someone. So we have someone here from Pricingius. 28 00:07:50.010 --> 00:07:53.669 Dinesh Chatoth: Yes, yes, I'm here from 29 00:07:54.060 --> 00:07:57.500 Curtis Phillips: all right. So the only one that's really missing. Then is 30 00:07:57.580 --> 00:07:59.260 Curtis Phillips: Um, 31 00:07:59.680 --> 00:08:00.670 Yes, 32 00:08:01.540 --> 00:08:02.500 Okay, 33 00:08:07.440 --> 00:08:08.730 Curtis Phillips: Um. 34 00:08:09.630 --> 00:08:13.820 Curtis Phillips: Do. We have a phone number? We can call Kelly see if we can get her on here. 35 00:08:16.750 --> 00:08:18.309 Curtis Phillips: If I have anything. 36 00:08:21.160 --> 00:08:30.429 Adrienne: We also have a couple of more from for any is here. It's Adrian and Martha. So we have a couple of folks here. 37 00:08:33.289 --> 00:08:34.560 yvette.brown: Um, 38 00:08:35.169 --> 00:08:49.029 Curtis Phillips: okay. I can send you a number 39 00:08:49.150 --> 00:08:50.850 LISA REES: if you want to. 40 00:08:51.810 --> 00:08:53.010 LISA REES: Um. 41 00:08:54.830 --> 00:08:57.910 LISA REES: So a situation's happened. 42 00:08:58.100 --> 00:09:07.130 LISA REES: Um over the weekend, and we need to take time to discuss that before we move on to discussing. 43 00:09:07.430 --> 00:09:08.660 LISA REES: Um. 44 00:09:08.910 --> 00:09:19.229 LISA REES: I can't guarantee that this conversation won't take up the full length of time that we have allotted for this meeting. 45 00:09:19.480 --> 00:09:33.440 LISA REES: Um! So we may have to postpone our discussion about the pertinentis module, but because it is time sensitive for us to um 46 00:09:33.600 --> 00:09:46.130 LISA REES: get any comments to move forward in this pi we may have to look at trying to schedule something next week if we don't get to that discussion now. 47 00:09:46.440 --> 00:09:47.700 LISA REES: Um, 48 00:09:52.470 --> 00:10:02.170 Adrienne: i'm sorry Lisa did. Were you saying we might have to postpone the pair tonight's discussion. I I missed it a little bit. 49 00:10:02.570 --> 00:10:10.180 LISA REES: Uh, and if we do have to postpone it, we will look at setting something up next week because we are 50 00:10:10.460 --> 00:10:16.849 LISA REES: working on that in this Api we need to get any revisions solidified. So 51 00:10:17.180 --> 00:10:33.320 Adrienne: oh, yeah, cause we have Um, Dr. Chadd from the medical office here on the call with us today, Lisa from Forsenia. So is the what we're gonna be talking about in this work group, mostly just stuff and not the pertinent is 52 00:10:33.820 --> 00:10:43.029 LISA REES: I I. There is a situation that's happened that we need to discuss, and I don't know how long that will take 53 00:10:43.210 --> 00:10:57.259 LISA REES: um If it does not take the whole hour. We'll move into discussion discussing, and we're very grateful for the doctors that have come to look at this and speak with us. 54 00:10:57.270 --> 00:11:06.579 LISA REES: Um, This is just something that happened very unexpectedly that we need to to have to some discussion surrounding. 55 00:11:06.730 --> 00:11:14.600 Dinesh Chatoth: Okay, 56 00:11:14.620 --> 00:11:21.100 Adrienne: Yeah, that's what I was gonna ask you. Do you want to just hang out, or do you want me to ping you when we get to pertinent it's 57 00:11:21.770 --> 00:11:30.489 Adrienne: i'll i'll ping you when we get to pair of tomatoes. Thank you so much, 58 00:11:30.590 --> 00:11:37.989 LISA REES: and and I apologize that that we've had a mine of an emergency of some. What 59 00:11:38.560 --> 00:11:46.730 LISA REES: an emergency, so to speak, come up that we need to to preempt this call. But, um! 60 00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:50.959 LISA REES: He can't account for all situations. 61 00:11:59.800 --> 00:12:10.029 LISA REES: I'm not sure exactly what else to say until Kart comes back, because I don't really want to open the discussion of peritinitis uh and have to stop 62 00:12:10.270 --> 00:12:15.079 LISA REES: to start the other discussion. I don't. I don't think that would be beneficial. 63 00:13:11.480 --> 00:13:16.099 LISA REES: Arnie, do you have any cool music like Aaron usually has? 64 00:13:16.660 --> 00:13:20.549 Arnie Espartero: Um No, sorry I don't I wasn't prepared 65 00:14:43.990 --> 00:14:49.610 LISA REES: the Tina. Are you on the call? Would you like to start this discussion while we're waiting on cart? 66 00:14:49.930 --> 00:14:55.549 Betina Fletcher: Um, I am on the call. I was just calling for, 67 00:14:56.000 --> 00:15:04.629 Curtis Phillips: so give me one second, see if you just wanted us to go ahead and get started. 68 00:15:04.730 --> 00:15:07.949 Curtis Phillips: Get Howard on the phone, But if you could just bear with me a minute. Okay. 69 00:15:08.990 --> 00:15:15.169 Betina Fletcher: So you want us to wait for you. 70 00:16:04.590 --> 00:16:09.060 Curtis Phillips: Okay, I apologize. Um. It took me a while to get someone. Um! 71 00:16:09.100 --> 00:16:20.959 Curtis Phillips: So Howard isn't going to be able to join us. We're not going to be able to get anyone from our H on the call today. Um! So I apologize. It looks like we'll just go ahead and proceed um 72 00:16:21.320 --> 00:16:23.819 Curtis Phillips: with the uh with the discussion. 73 00:16:24.030 --> 00:16:28.590 Curtis Phillips: Um, i'm sorry. Did you start anything. Lisa. Why, I was off. 74 00:16:29.150 --> 00:16:41.490 Curtis Phillips: Okay. Um. Why, don't we, Nathan? Um. Why, don't we start with you? Maybe you can do a quick summary of uh from your perspective 75 00:16:41.500 --> 00:16:51.990 Curtis Phillips: what happened yesterday, and how it might affect all of our um. Edi submitters, and we can kind of start the conversation there. Does that make sense. 76 00:16:53.440 --> 00:17:03.629 Nathan Muzos: Yeah, I can do that. Uh, And I also, uh, as others have apologized, I, too, would like to apologize, not just for preempting the uh 77 00:17:03.790 --> 00:17:07.379 Nathan Muzos: here tonight is discussion which, as many of this group knows. 78 00:17:07.560 --> 00:17:11.270 Nathan Muzos: Uh, I'm interested in us, having uh, but just for 79 00:17:11.420 --> 00:17:15.179 Nathan Muzos: us, having to to work through all of this issue. 80 00:17:15.940 --> 00:17:18.280 Nathan Muzos: So we 81 00:17:18.390 --> 00:17:19.760 Nathan Muzos: um 82 00:17:21.270 --> 00:17:26.289 Nathan Muzos: we did our normal submission patient demographic submission on Monday. 83 00:17:26.310 --> 00:17:37.530 Nathan Muzos: Uh, unfortunately, over the weekend, we had an internal data issue where we pulled in a a lot more records than we normally would have, most of them historical 84 00:17:38.530 --> 00:17:43.370 Nathan Muzos: and a lot of them short-term um at type admissions. And so 85 00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:47.149 Nathan Muzos: don't know the full extent, because the 86 00:17:47.910 --> 00:17:53.229 Nathan Muzos: we don't always see the other half of the records. Um, but for the 87 00:17:53.370 --> 00:17:55.740 Nathan Muzos: the number of records that we've looked at. 88 00:17:56.240 --> 00:17:59.680 Nathan Muzos: Uh, what we're consistently seeing is we've 89 00:18:00.230 --> 00:18:03.170 Nathan Muzos: in a lot of cases created system discharges 90 00:18:03.760 --> 00:18:06.989 Nathan Muzos: from what is the accurate record? 91 00:18:07.260 --> 00:18:10.799 Nathan Muzos: Um. And so the patient looks like they're not in a 92 00:18:11.400 --> 00:18:13.110 Nathan Muzos: that clinic anymore. 93 00:18:13.360 --> 00:18:17.870 Nathan Muzos: There isn't a consistency, you know It's not 94 00:18:18.010 --> 00:18:19.120 Nathan Muzos: uh 95 00:18:19.590 --> 00:18:25.389 Nathan Muzos: this type of admission or this length of admission or this specific date range 96 00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:29.389 Nathan Muzos: um, which makes you know it harder to determine the full scope 97 00:18:29.910 --> 00:18:32.320 Nathan Muzos: of the issue. Um! 98 00:18:32.500 --> 00:18:41.139 Nathan Muzos: And that's so. That's why, for for those Edi submitters. You know why I sent the email yesterday about potentially pausing your submissions. 99 00:18:41.220 --> 00:18:43.770 Nathan Muzos: Um, just how we get a better 100 00:18:44.280 --> 00:18:46.469 Nathan Muzos: understanding of the scope. 101 00:18:46.540 --> 00:18:47.570 Um. 102 00:18:47.670 --> 00:18:51.479 Nathan Muzos: And also, so that you just aren't facing potentially, you know, 103 00:18:52.350 --> 00:19:00.410 Nathan Muzos: a large volume of rejections, and trying to chase those down when it's not something with new, with your logic, that kind of thing. 104 00:19:06.310 --> 00:19:08.990 Curtis Phillips: So does anyone have any questions for Nathan? 105 00:19:13.120 --> 00:19:16.700 Nathan Muzos: Of course not. They fully understand everything. After that, 106 00:19:18.130 --> 00:19:27.410 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: Nathan. Thank you for letting us know I mean. So now, right now we've passed our patient submission for um. Your message yesterday. 107 00:19:27.520 --> 00:19:36.450 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: This is here for prisoners. Um! So of course, my question is, you know, when can we resume 108 00:19:37.140 --> 00:19:38.280 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: um? 109 00:19:40.170 --> 00:19:53.829 Curtis Phillips: So, Revathy? We've had some internal discussions here at Cms this morning. Um, and we're really we've really kind of looked at two two approaches. One is, if there was a way that we could 110 00:19:53.930 --> 00:20:07.310 Curtis Phillips: um clearly identify all the records that would need to be uh cleaned up, and and you know, to script um a clean up of those records. Um! 111 00:20:07.320 --> 00:20:18.700 Curtis Phillips: We think that that could be very time consuming, and could take a lot of um a lot of work, plus we are concerned that it is an introduces a certain level of risk. 112 00:20:18.710 --> 00:20:30.219 Curtis Phillips: Um in that we may, if if there was an error or something was overlooked. Um! We might not catch. We might not catch everything in either our analysis or the script, or 113 00:20:30.250 --> 00:20:37.289 Curtis Phillips: or even what if the script was made an error? So we think we have a lot of concerns about 114 00:20:37.670 --> 00:20:53.440 Curtis Phillips: that approach that we believe that introduces a lot of risk. Not only um, you know, to the integrity of the data in the system, but for everyone who's you know who's submitting. So I i'm very concerned about taking that approach. The second approach that we're 115 00:20:53.450 --> 00:21:12.469 Curtis Phillips: um that we looked at today was rolling back to a point in time. Um! And and that would roll the the entire Ecos database back to a a point in time before um. The data was, you know, the invalid data was submitted. Um, 116 00:21:13.180 --> 00:21:20.220 Curtis Phillips: so. And I'm, And we're struggling with the word invalid data that it was data. It was. It was data that passed. 117 00:21:20.310 --> 00:21:26.220 Curtis Phillips: It was. It was I don't know what we want to call this data. But it was. The data was 118 00:21:26.630 --> 00:21:46.479 Curtis Phillips: was bad data. Um, it was validated, but it was. It was incorrect. Data, I guess is the best way. Um, because it wouldn't have. It wouldn't have tripped any of our validations on the way in um, because all the the records that were submitted were were would have passed all the validation. So 119 00:21:46.560 --> 00:21:54.089 Curtis Phillips: anyway, we're looking at we're looking at rolling back to a point in time. We think that that provides um 120 00:21:54.320 --> 00:22:12.859 Curtis Phillips: Yeah. V. Now a bit erroneous. There we go, I i'm struggling with the right words, Thanks for that great, valid, but erroneous um. So we're looking at rolling back to a point in time prior to um, you know, Prior to the submission, the challenge there is, I think, that that 121 00:22:12.870 --> 00:22:28.450 Curtis Phillips: all the Edi submitters based upon our discussions. And And, Nathan, I think you'd agree uh the prudent thing would be for all the Edi submitters not just to be to to resubmit, but all everyone to submit up to this, you know, up to the current time, 122 00:22:28.460 --> 00:22:37.219 Curtis Phillips: so you there could be. There's going to be, an you know a certain number of files that are going to have to be resubmitted. I wanted to talk to all of you about that today. 123 00:22:37.230 --> 00:22:51.559 Curtis Phillips: Um, it's a big decision. Um, It's gonna take a lot of coordination. We haven't really started started putting together a plan because I wanted to talk to all of you. And so I see your feedback. We recognize there's going to be a certain level of 124 00:22:51.570 --> 00:23:00.729 Curtis Phillips: of uh burden, and there's gonna be work here. But we think that you know that offers the best uh 125 00:23:00.790 --> 00:23:14.500 Curtis Phillips: best solution to get us back to. You know the level. They have the data at a higher, high level of integrity. So i'm gonna that's a lot. I'm gonna pause there. We so, or anyone else from my team. Is there anything that I that I overlooked. 126 00:23:16.500 --> 00:23:22.550 LISA REES: No, but I will just mention one thing that might be of interest 127 00:23:22.650 --> 00:23:37.880 LISA REES: to the Eds submitters. The Ncc. Ran a gap report this morning, and they're only seeing, like point four percent difference from the gap report last week 128 00:23:39.350 --> 00:23:43.340 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: fifteen hundred and fifty-eight patients dig uh to the exact. 129 00:23:49.090 --> 00:23:50.660 Nathan Muzos: That's encouraging. 130 00:23:51.890 --> 00:23:56.579 Chris Brown: Yeah, I did the same thing. This is Chris at three and four. I did the same thing for network four this morning, and 131 00:23:56.690 --> 00:24:05.009 Chris Brown: thinking it'd be a higher impact, and I saw just a handful of records I expected, you know, hundreds or thousands more gap patients with their only um 132 00:24:05.190 --> 00:24:07.930 Chris Brown: thirty, forty something like that. Maybe not even that many. 133 00:24:12.070 --> 00:24:24.720 Kathleen Prewitt: But a gap patient is where there's no subsequent admission. Nathan, when you said you think you might have created a bunch of system discharges Doesn't that imply that there's a following admission. 134 00:24:28.380 --> 00:24:29.760 Nathan Muzos: Yeah. 135 00:24:30.420 --> 00:24:31.410 Nathan Muzos: But 136 00:24:32.780 --> 00:24:43.769 Nathan Muzos: I don't know that it's a following open admission. So a lot of ours because they were historical records. It was a completed admission and discharge, 137 00:24:44.120 --> 00:24:53.110 Chris Brown: because the other thing I did was look at, were they in a different facility last week compared to today, and there's not a whole lot of those, either that are non-normal. 138 00:24:53.310 --> 00:25:03.389 Kathleen Prewitt: Did so. Did anyone run a system discharge report and see if that yeah, there's a network for the only fifty or sixty which is not out of the norm 139 00:25:05.190 --> 00:25:07.769 LISA REES: in the Ncc. Run that Janet. 140 00:25:10.380 --> 00:25:14.079 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: Yes, ma'am, um. I had not done it yet, but will 141 00:25:14.360 --> 00:25:15.440 thank you. 142 00:25:15.690 --> 00:25:17.469 LISA REES: We'll get that for you, 143 00:25:19.220 --> 00:25:32.490 Chris Brown: Nathan. Were these in a specific timeframe like you should we look at system discharges prior to x-date? Or is it possible? It's, you know, even system discharges and inverting emissions you know September of two thousand and twenty-two 144 00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:35.559 Nathan Muzos: no it's 145 00:25:36.100 --> 00:25:37.739 Nathan Muzos: all kind of 146 00:25:38.730 --> 00:25:43.040 Nathan Muzos: timeframes. And so the system discharge 147 00:25:43.540 --> 00:25:48.829 Nathan Muzos: because our admission is, uh, not confined to a specific date range. 148 00:25:48.920 --> 00:25:51.030 Nathan Muzos: The system discharge date 149 00:25:51.520 --> 00:25:57.479 Nathan Muzos: either it just, you know, as you know it's the day before, whatever admission we put in 150 00:25:59.470 --> 00:26:03.859 Nathan Muzos: so like. There's a dci record. I I know that's one example. 151 00:26:04.140 --> 00:26:11.640 Nathan Muzos: You know. We put in an admission from two thousand and fourteen. So the system discharged. Date is two thousand and thirteen or sorry, two thousand and fourteen, 152 00:26:14.970 --> 00:26:21.459 Chris Brown: You know, when I ran the system Discharge report this morning, Janet. I'm sure you'll do like a you know, date range at all. But I did from twenty 153 00:26:22.180 --> 00:26:26.640 Chris Brown: two thousand and two, maybe to two thousand and twenty-two, and still only had that short number of 154 00:26:26.730 --> 00:26:28.400 Chris Brown: system discharges. 155 00:26:28.880 --> 00:26:32.240 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: Um. What i'm thinking I might 156 00:26:32.260 --> 00:26:47.369 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: might be useful here is to look for um system discharges with a system update timestamp of Nathan when approximately, do you think this might have happened? 157 00:26:47.590 --> 00:26:59.310 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: This So the seventeen? Okay, I just didn't know if I needed to look at two days ago or two weeks ago. No, it yeah, it. It was an internal update over the weekend, and then, with our submission on Monday, 158 00:26:59.560 --> 00:27:17.219 Geraldine Bojarski: N. N. This is Geraldine from dci um the one that you refer to in dci um was not Monday that was last week, and i'm the one that reported it to the lad. So this may have happened prior to the Monday, 159 00:27:17.230 --> 00:27:23.720 Geraldine Bojarski: but I know the one in Dci, where we had the two thousand and fourteen admission. That system discharged our patient. 160 00:27:23.790 --> 00:27:26.910 Geraldine Bojarski: Um! That was not this week. That was last week. 161 00:27:27.400 --> 00:27:32.030 Nathan Muzos: Yeah, I think I know what you're talking about, Geraldine, and I think that's a 162 00:27:32.150 --> 00:27:33.710 Nathan Muzos: a different issue. 163 00:27:35.530 --> 00:27:38.749 Nathan Muzos: That's more confined to that 164 00:27:38.950 --> 00:27:40.620 Nathan Muzos: set of patients. 165 00:27:41.800 --> 00:27:42.940 Nathan Muzos: Uh, 166 00:27:43.710 --> 00:27:45.739 Nathan Muzos: you know it's not this broader 167 00:27:45.860 --> 00:27:49.110 Nathan Muzos: internal data update that happened this past weekend. 168 00:27:51.450 --> 00:28:00.609 Curtis Phillips: So in the initial email that came out, Nathan, I looked. It sounded like it was the trial where this this occurred 169 00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:04.350 Curtis Phillips: was ten, sixteen at one. Pm: Is that right? 170 00:28:04.380 --> 00:28:11.090 Curtis Phillips: That's what initially came out. Is that correct? Anything anything after that could be? 171 00:28:11.170 --> 00:28:12.330 Curtis Phillips: Um 172 00:28:12.800 --> 00:28:14.100 Curtis Phillips: in question. 173 00:28:18.860 --> 00:28:20.480 Nathan Muzos: Yeah, Sarah, 174 00:28:21.320 --> 00:28:24.180 Nathan Muzos: if you can jump in here. Um. 175 00:28:24.390 --> 00:28:28.779 Nathan Muzos: Do you know, when our submission on Monday started, or did it start Sunday, 176 00:28:37.780 --> 00:28:40.120 Curtis Phillips: Sarah? Here are the other issues 177 00:28:48.010 --> 00:28:55.309 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: That would actually be a very useful piece of information for me, because we um 178 00:28:55.630 --> 00:28:57.559 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: at the 179 00:28:57.900 --> 00:29:15.890 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: rather than putting continuous drain on the redshift data, we have certain tables that we pull into um a temporary hive storage, and that generally happens early early morning on Monday, so I could compare what was there then, And what's there now? 180 00:29:19.450 --> 00:29:22.089 Nathan Muzos: Okay, Yeah, we're getting. 181 00:29:24.540 --> 00:29:26.659 Nathan Muzos: I'll get the exact time. 182 00:29:27.060 --> 00:29:29.989 Nathan Muzos: Um! When our submission started. 183 00:29:30.780 --> 00:29:33.090 Nathan Muzos: I think Sara's having some audio 184 00:29:40.480 --> 00:29:42.000 Nathan Muzos: eight Am. Monday. 185 00:29:43.590 --> 00:29:52.770 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: Yes, before or after eight Am. Monday. 186 00:29:55.050 --> 00:29:56.710 Vlad Ladik: So 187 00:30:01.350 --> 00:30:02.209 that's it. 188 00:30:08.290 --> 00:30:11.640 LISA REES: I want to ask you a little bit about 189 00:30:12.320 --> 00:30:23.650 LISA REES: what Geraldine brought up about a previous incident incidents. How many patients were involved in in that 190 00:30:23.840 --> 00:30:25.100 LISA REES: issue? 191 00:30:25.910 --> 00:30:29.040 Geraldine Bojarski: I I I know. I know that I had reported 192 00:30:29.090 --> 00:30:38.370 Geraldine Bojarski: two to the lad, and I see that Vlad is on the phone now. He was at the airport. That's kind of why i'm covering for him. Um, he might want to talk now. 193 00:30:38.890 --> 00:30:42.189 Vlad Ladik: Yeah, I just got off the plane, so 194 00:30:42.270 --> 00:30:45.349 Vlad Ladik: I was sorry I missed the beginning of a call. 195 00:30:47.840 --> 00:31:02.139 Geraldine Bojarski: Glad we were discussing the fact that there were those two patients that both Janet and I had reported that had um admissions from Davida, that we're back from two thousand and fourteen, but that wasn't this week that was last week. 196 00:31:08.320 --> 00:31:09.450 Vlad Ladik: Uh, 197 00:31:09.880 --> 00:31:11.399 Vlad Ladik: Nathan, I 198 00:31:21.180 --> 00:31:28.350 LISA REES: So, Nathan. How many patients were involved in that? And have we got them all resolved? 199 00:31:29.060 --> 00:31:32.949 Nathan Muzos: Yeah, that one we we don't know Um, 200 00:31:35.610 --> 00:31:38.990 Nathan Muzos: because it's just yeah, you know. Vlad did send over these two 201 00:31:39.060 --> 00:31:40.280 Nathan Muzos: patience. 202 00:31:40.340 --> 00:31:43.729 Nathan Muzos: So we're not sure if that's a a broader issue or not. 203 00:31:46.980 --> 00:31:48.240 LISA REES: So 204 00:31:48.800 --> 00:31:50.360 LISA REES: what kind of 205 00:31:50.960 --> 00:31:57.130 LISA REES: what cost analysis, if you done on that, was Was that a 206 00:31:58.370 --> 00:32:00.360 LISA REES: portents of 207 00:32:00.850 --> 00:32:03.410 LISA REES: of this occurring? I mean, 208 00:32:04.340 --> 00:32:10.769 LISA REES: we. We kind of need to know if if you've been leaking this data along for a while, 209 00:32:12.310 --> 00:32:13.789 LISA REES: or if 210 00:32:15.370 --> 00:32:18.650 LISA REES: we need to figure out when this started, 211 00:32:18.940 --> 00:32:22.289 LISA REES: and how bad it is, so we can get it cleaned up 212 00:32:22.690 --> 00:32:23.730 Nathan Muzos: right. 213 00:32:24.020 --> 00:32:25.130 Nathan Muzos: So 214 00:32:25.360 --> 00:32:28.989 Nathan Muzos: you know, our our submissions have been 215 00:32:29.180 --> 00:32:31.290 Nathan Muzos: what I would call normal 216 00:32:31.730 --> 00:32:38.030 Nathan Muzos: uh until this past week. You know our the size of our submissions, the volume of data, that sort of thing. 217 00:32:38.150 --> 00:32:43.130 Nathan Muzos: Obviously the internal update that occurred this weekend was a 218 00:32:43.500 --> 00:32:45.179 Nathan Muzos: one time event. 219 00:32:45.640 --> 00:32:46.730 Nathan Muzos: Um 220 00:32:46.770 --> 00:32:48.699 Nathan Muzos: to one of our other systems. 221 00:32:48.850 --> 00:32:50.010 Nathan Muzos: And so 222 00:32:50.770 --> 00:32:51.749 Nathan Muzos: you know, 223 00:32:52.420 --> 00:33:00.129 Nathan Muzos: i'm not going to say. I can't say that you know our previous submissions didn't contain some errors. I think all of us continually work to make our submissions better. 224 00:33:00.230 --> 00:33:02.450 Nathan Muzos: And you know, luckily, this group 225 00:33:02.560 --> 00:33:05.129 Nathan Muzos: uh collaborates a lot 226 00:33:05.160 --> 00:33:08.499 Nathan Muzos: when we have issues like this, you know, Vlad sent me the cases, and 227 00:33:08.590 --> 00:33:15.219 Nathan Muzos: the team is looking into them to see if it is a a broader logic issue it's a one-time thing, that kind of thing. 228 00:33:15.660 --> 00:33:16.520 Nathan Muzos: But 229 00:33:16.790 --> 00:33:20.639 Nathan Muzos: the events that occurred over the last couple days, 230 00:33:20.870 --> 00:33:25.539 Nathan Muzos: we know, is an isolated incident that was triggered by an internal thing. 231 00:33:25.690 --> 00:33:28.560 Nathan Muzos: Um, like, I said by one of our other source systems. 232 00:33:33.490 --> 00:33:36.449 Curtis Phillips: Yeah. So that's a separate issue. Correct 233 00:33:36.650 --> 00:33:39.360 Curtis Phillips: There, that is unrelated to this 234 00:33:40.100 --> 00:33:49.609 Nathan Muzos: right. And it could be those two patients. It it could be broader. It could be an easy logic fix for us, You know we were treating it just like any other concern that, 235 00:33:49.810 --> 00:33:55.059 Nathan Muzos: uh, whether it's an internal person or one of the Edis brings up of a hey? Here's a record. 236 00:33:55.780 --> 00:33:57.400 Nathan Muzos: Can you look to see what 237 00:33:57.500 --> 00:33:59.279 Nathan Muzos: your your logic is doing 238 00:33:59.470 --> 00:34:03.740 Nathan Muzos: um. We also don't know for those two, 239 00:34:03.810 --> 00:34:05.760 Nathan Muzos: you know specifically. Was it 240 00:34:06.150 --> 00:34:10.979 Nathan Muzos: a batch submission that did it? Because we can't tell. You know Batch versus manual 241 00:34:11.270 --> 00:34:15.229 Nathan Muzos: um, which is always uh something that comes into play 242 00:34:15.370 --> 00:34:18.150 Nathan Muzos: in these kind of one-off scenarios. 243 00:34:23.989 --> 00:34:26.979 Curtis Phillips: So back to the issue that we um 244 00:34:28.500 --> 00:34:34.009 Curtis Phillips: or talking about that happened over the weekend. So, Sarah, I know you're having some audio, 245 00:34:34.780 --> 00:34:41.170 Curtis Phillips: but I put in the chat kind of what you would put in the what you would put in the email. Um, 246 00:34:42.350 --> 00:34:43.529 Curtis Phillips: Is that 247 00:34:44.040 --> 00:34:47.260 Curtis Phillips: is that correct? Is as anything changed, 248 00:34:51.130 --> 00:34:53.979 SFILLING: Hey, Curtis, Can you hear me? 249 00:34:54.870 --> 00:34:56.179 SFILLING: Okay, Awesome. 250 00:35:00.390 --> 00:35:04.999 SFILLING: So we completed our last on 251 00:35:05.140 --> 00:35:06.709 SFILLING: unaffected 252 00:35:06.730 --> 00:35:11.310 SFILLING: patient demo batch on Friday in a post-product validation 253 00:35:11.470 --> 00:35:20.359 SFILLING: and the release that that occurred that in the incident that occurred um that affected our Monday sufficient happened over the weekend 254 00:35:25.350 --> 00:35:28.449 SFILLING: that was affected until Monday. 255 00:35:28.860 --> 00:35:34.580 SFILLING: Does that make sense? We submitted a normal patient demo data. On On Friday, the fourteenth, 256 00:35:35.310 --> 00:35:42.950 SFILLING: the properties happened over the weekend. And then on Monday the seventeenth was when we submitted the erroneous data. 257 00:35:43.510 --> 00:35:48.959 Curtis Phillips: Okay. So you, when you had said ten, sixteen at one. Pm: What was the basis of that? 258 00:35:50.230 --> 00:35:52.789 SFILLING: So ten, sixteen would have been 259 00:35:54.670 --> 00:35:55.890 Curtis Phillips: Sunday. 260 00:35:57.470 --> 00:35:59.210 SFILLING: That was Sunday. 261 00:35:59.790 --> 00:36:01.000 SFILLING: That's Sunday. 262 00:36:01.100 --> 00:36:05.669 SFILLING: Um, i'm getting you the exact time stamps on on that uh 263 00:36:05.700 --> 00:36:08.520 SFILLING: the patient demo job that was submitted on. 264 00:36:09.370 --> 00:36:10.410 Curtis Phillips: Okay, 265 00:36:10.690 --> 00:36:13.049 SFILLING: I think there was an additional 266 00:36:14.350 --> 00:36:16.029 SFILLING: validation 267 00:36:16.160 --> 00:36:21.240 SFILLING: that we did on another release on Friday. So i'm going to get you all those times stand. 268 00:36:21.260 --> 00:36:26.919 SFILLING: Yeah, I'm trying to figure i'm trying to figure out, you know, if 269 00:36:26.980 --> 00:36:29.449 Curtis Phillips: what I need to roll back to? 270 00:36:32.020 --> 00:36:36.370 Curtis Phillips: When was the, you know? When When was the system 271 00:36:37.300 --> 00:36:52.359 Curtis Phillips: correct? Last correct? We're sure that it was last. The date in the system was last valid and then grow back to that point, and then just submit data from that point forward so that get us to get us current and get get correct. 272 00:36:53.360 --> 00:36:55.580 SFILLING: Yeah. So I'm. Just making sure that 273 00:36:56.110 --> 00:37:01.499 SFILLING: nothing was submitted on Sunday to do that. That post-prod validation after 274 00:37:02.360 --> 00:37:04.209 SFILLING: the other prod release happened. 275 00:37:04.330 --> 00:37:06.030 SFILLING: Okay, So i'm 276 00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:09.760 Nathan Muzos: and Kurt. Is there a 277 00:37:10.910 --> 00:37:24.800 Nathan Muzos: frequency with which you can roll back? Not like? Can we do this every week? But i'm 278 00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:41.879 Curtis Phillips: if you told me um, roll back to ten, sixteen, you know, at twelve fifty-nine Pm. I can't roll back there, but I can roll back by day. So I can roll back to the beginning of of Sunday or the beginning of Monday. It's a day by day Thing 279 00:37:41.940 --> 00:37:54.030 Curtis Phillips: I would probably, you know, roll back to, you know, depending on what you end up saying to to the you know, probably to Sunday or Saturday. Whatever it made sense, 280 00:37:54.130 --> 00:38:04.580 Vlad Ladik: can I? I? I know i'm the beginning of a call. Can you give me like one? Me not highlight? What was the issue? 281 00:38:05.360 --> 00:38:08.779 Vlad Ladik: What what kind of data was submitted? That was wrong? 282 00:38:10.780 --> 00:38:19.960 Nathan Muzos: Sounds like a Nathan Kind of Yeah, Vlad, It's just It's a bunch of historical records and a lot of them are short term. 283 00:38:20.390 --> 00:38:28.600 Nathan Muzos: Okay? And then a system discharged or stole, 284 00:38:28.650 --> 00:38:29.589 Nathan Muzos: you know, 285 00:38:29.620 --> 00:38:32.550 Nathan Muzos: if it wasn't a a closed admission 286 00:38:33.210 --> 00:38:36.390 Nathan Muzos: uh either system discharge from your clinic, 287 00:38:36.520 --> 00:38:42.630 Nathan Muzos: or or admitted to us, and left the admission open. Most of them are system discharges, 288 00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:45.070 Nathan Muzos: sort of thing. 289 00:38:46.250 --> 00:38:47.330 Vlad Ladik: Okay. 290 00:38:47.470 --> 00:38:48.740 Nathan Muzos: So if we 291 00:38:49.540 --> 00:38:52.249 Nathan Muzos: let's say we're going to roll back to Saturday, 292 00:38:53.360 --> 00:39:00.559 Nathan Muzos: then I think the question for the others, is, what volume of submissions has anyone done since then 293 00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:03.390 Nathan Muzos: that they'd have to send again? 294 00:39:05.350 --> 00:39:07.919 Leah Skrien: And when you say, roll back, 295 00:39:08.150 --> 00:39:15.109 Leah Skrien: what is that? Everything or just admissions. Does it include forms that were submitted in that timeframe? 296 00:39:17.720 --> 00:39:21.130 Leah Skrien: I guess what's included in a role? If you did that 297 00:39:22.710 --> 00:39:25.749 Curtis Phillips: awesome, can you help me with that one, I I mean, and 298 00:39:26.180 --> 00:39:29.569 Branon Barrett: it would be patient 299 00:39:29.900 --> 00:39:33.509 Branon Barrett: uh patient mission 300 00:39:38.670 --> 00:39:49.819 Leah Skrien: and death notifications, and the at two, seven, four to six 301 00:39:50.270 --> 00:39:52.649 Leah Skrien: project as well, potentially. 302 00:39:54.410 --> 00:40:06.130 Leah Skrien: Um: Well, yeah, I I think it will it it going to roll back Brandon. Any clinical data that manually entering facilities might be doing this week. 303 00:40:06.640 --> 00:40:09.580 Branon Barrett: No clinical data, but not you. Roll back. 304 00:40:10.990 --> 00:40:15.659 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: Okay. So so there's no impact of clinical. You're saying only patient. 305 00:40:15.880 --> 00:40:18.019 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: And what about depression? Data? 306 00:40:20.170 --> 00:40:21.209 yvette.brown: No, 307 00:40:21.940 --> 00:40:35.879 yvette.brown: no impact. Okay, so it's just patient ten, seven, twenty-eight, twenty-seven, forty-six 308 00:40:36.120 --> 00:40:54.709 yvette.brown: um If if any of the data included a death notice, and maybe someone in the Ui created the um twenty-seven, forty-six, or it included. Um. You know a generation of a twenty-seven twenty-eight form and someone in the Ui then created that form 309 00:40:55.460 --> 00:41:01.759 yvette.brown: so we just want to make sure that Um, Those two things are also covered as well. 310 00:41:02.380 --> 00:41:03.370 Okay, 311 00:41:03.500 --> 00:41:07.450 Vlad Ladik: I mean, one way to deal with it is just to 312 00:41:07.670 --> 00:41:13.240 Vlad Ladik: make make a small copy of records that were enter to modify it 313 00:41:13.750 --> 00:41:23.259 Vlad Ladik: uh since Saturday year. So since Friday whatever, and i'm talking about twenty-seven, twenty-eight, twenty-seven forty-six records. 314 00:41:24.740 --> 00:41:29.519 Vlad Ladik: If you make a copy of those records you can send, restore, 315 00:41:29.820 --> 00:41:30.959 Vlad Ladik: uh, 316 00:41:31.420 --> 00:41:39.759 Vlad Ladik: set the back up and apply those records back kind of Well, it would require some program programming time, 317 00:41:40.620 --> 00:41:42.180 Vlad Ladik: but it's doable. 318 00:41:49.820 --> 00:41:53.050 SFILLING: Okay, Um, this is Sarah. I've got an exact. 319 00:41:58.530 --> 00:42:00.089 SFILLING: This issue 320 00:42:00.390 --> 00:42:11.720 SFILLING: was submitted. It started the job started running at six o three Am. Mountain time on Monday, and completed at eight fifty-five Am. Mountain time on Monday, 321 00:42:12.630 --> 00:42:14.019 SFILLING: the seventeenth 322 00:42:14.310 --> 00:42:16.790 SFILLING: everything else be before that 323 00:42:16.820 --> 00:42:18.160 SFILLING: unaffected 324 00:42:18.450 --> 00:42:19.459 Okay. 325 00:42:21.700 --> 00:42:32.300 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: And and it's going forward right? So you you did any more submissions after that. 326 00:42:33.210 --> 00:42:45.110 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: So either you and Nathan K. Do you mind just sending those timings as Well, please uh to that threat. Nathan started or put it in the chat. 327 00:42:52.980 --> 00:42:55.719 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: Okay, so um 328 00:42:55.780 --> 00:42:59.399 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: and and and that's helpful, so we can um. 329 00:42:59.520 --> 00:43:06.830 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: So as long as it's, only, you know, patient two hundred and twenty- and forty-six. We can uh work through that, because 330 00:43:07.850 --> 00:43:18.810 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: even today we um did at twenty-seven, twenty-eight, not knowing. I thought we thought we my understanding was we were only going to hold patient right? 331 00:43:19.360 --> 00:43:23.770 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: Um! So we did do our one hundred and twenty-eight and um 332 00:43:23.880 --> 00:43:29.370 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: today in two thousand and twenty-six years today, and twenty-seven twenty-eight yesterday, too. So 333 00:43:30.310 --> 00:43:37.839 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: we we need to take care. I mean, you know, uh potentially redo those that's what we're saying. If you revert back to 334 00:43:38.740 --> 00:43:41.160 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: uh Sunday state status or whatever 335 00:43:45.070 --> 00:43:49.400 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: right our clinical submissions not impacted, Nothing else impacted. 336 00:43:50.450 --> 00:43:52.939 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: Depression. Nothing else is impacted. 337 00:43:53.650 --> 00:44:00.610 Chris Brown: I'm guessing this is a No. But vaccinations are not impacted either. Right? 338 00:44:00.800 --> 00:44:10.799 Pani Palanichamy FKC: Yeah, that very good question. 339 00:44:11.180 --> 00:44:14.699 Vlad Ladik: Everything is just coming with nine hundred and ninety-nine errors. 340 00:44:15.010 --> 00:44:23.369 yvette.brown: That's a separate and um issue that they send a notification out about the other day 341 00:44:24.840 --> 00:44:33.240 REVATHY RAMAKRISHNA: so it's not related. That's that's what you're clarifying Thank you. I mean, there's just so many different things so appreciate your help clarifying. 342 00:44:35.520 --> 00:44:39.530 Leah Skrien: We'll uh the microphone web team be sending out 343 00:44:39.920 --> 00:44:55.769 Leah Skrien: any sort of announcement or for those that are not Edi submitters? Is it up to the networks to send out an announcement about possibly redoing forms? 344 00:45:01.700 --> 00:45:05.089 Curtis Phillips: All right. Well, thank you for the discussion. Um, 345 00:45:05.340 --> 00:45:16.009 Curtis Phillips: I guess What i'm gonna ask my team to do now is to go back and put together a plan uh and communication um. We'll probably. Um. 346 00:45:16.570 --> 00:45:32.819 Curtis Phillips: We may have to reconvene um. I'm not sure yet, but we'll put together um communication and um, you know the the approach that we're gonna use, and and the timing of everything. Um! And then we want to circle back with with you guys, 347 00:45:37.880 --> 00:45:38.960 Vlad Ladik: do you? 348 00:45:39.280 --> 00:45:45.759 Vlad Ladik: Does it need to be a beacons to restore backup, or can you do it? 349 00:45:45.960 --> 00:45:47.350 Vlad Ladik: One of the 350 00:45:48.720 --> 00:45:52.699 Curtis Phillips: um. I'm gonna let you answer that one Brandon? 351 00:45:54.540 --> 00:45:59.970 Branon Barrett: Uh I mean, we can do it anytime. It just depends on what what we need to 352 00:46:00.170 --> 00:46:14.859 Branon Barrett: do as far as downtime for, uh incoming submissions. So in incoming the eds and submissions could could still theoretically continue. Um, the the Apis and and Ui would be 353 00:46:15.070 --> 00:46:31.270 Curtis Phillips: shut down for the for the restore. So I guess I guess in my mind, though Brandon, and and correct me if i'm wrong here. Um. So at six o three Am. Mountain time data was sent in the Us. Um. 354 00:46:31.360 --> 00:46:33.870 Curtis Phillips: So at that from that point on. 355 00:46:33.910 --> 00:46:38.250 Curtis Phillips: Um. We probably need to refresh all the data 356 00:46:38.390 --> 00:46:40.079 Curtis Phillips: that was submitted 357 00:46:41.160 --> 00:46:43.740 Curtis Phillips: after that time by 358 00:46:44.470 --> 00:46:51.789 Curtis Phillips: all the patient, all the patient data submitted after that time until currency. Is that correct? 359 00:46:52.170 --> 00:46:54.550 Curtis Phillips: Does that everyone understand that? Right? 360 00:46:54.740 --> 00:46:55.750 Vlad Ladik: Yes, 361 00:46:56.130 --> 00:46:57.220 Curtis Phillips: okay. 362 00:46:57.490 --> 00:47:09.329 Curtis Phillips: I just want to make sure, because that's what we're going to be looking to do. We're going to say we're going to restore it at a point in time, probably before that. And really say to you, if you submitted files 363 00:47:09.490 --> 00:47:18.610 Curtis Phillips: after this point in time you're going to read. You're going to need to resubmit all your um patient data again. 364 00:47:18.940 --> 00:47:25.029 Curtis Phillips: We'll give you guys. We'll give you a specific guidance. But that's that's essentially Do I have that right, Brandon? I think. 365 00:47:25.690 --> 00:47:26.770 Branon Barrett: Yes, sir. 366 00:47:27.050 --> 00:47:27.979 Okay. 367 00:47:28.150 --> 00:47:40.730 Kathleen Prewitt: So, Kurt: I just want to ask this question. I may have missed it. You're talk, you know. I'm hearing words resubmit files, but for people who are doing manual admissions like right now this week. 368 00:47:40.920 --> 00:47:45.100 Kathleen Prewitt: Um. Is it also going to wipe those out? And they're gonna have to redo them? 369 00:47:47.750 --> 00:47:59.939 Branon Barrett: Yeah, So we're We're looking at it uh capturing user the they data submitted via the Ui, and and reapplying that after the restore. So 370 00:48:00.450 --> 00:48:06.399 Kathleen Prewitt: okay, So you you would put those back on behalf of the manual entry people. 371 00:48:06.430 --> 00:48:09.710 Branon Barrett: Yes, that's the idea. 372 00:48:09.780 --> 00:48:16.630 Chris Brown: Are we sure that some of that manual entry might not have been reaction to the bad data that came in on ten, seventeen, 373 00:48:17.300 --> 00:48:20.889 Chris Brown: by ie. That Oh, the station belongs to me. I'm going to reit them. 374 00:48:21.960 --> 00:48:30.120 Nathan Muzos: Yeah, and versus instead of clearing out the system, discharge because they can't get rid of our admission. That's blocking it. Exactly. 375 00:48:30.440 --> 00:48:31.310 Branon Barrett: Hmm. 376 00:48:31.940 --> 00:48:33.140 Branon Barrett: So 377 00:48:33.910 --> 00:48:39.149 Chris Brown: I mean, I know It's gonna be difficult for people to swallow. But I'd almost support it just going back to, 378 00:48:39.350 --> 00:48:45.840 Chris Brown: you know, ten, fifteen, or sixteen, whatever date we choose, and just say nothing after that is going to be in the Qrs. When this is done. 379 00:48:47.600 --> 00:48:58.909 Vlad Ladik: Yeah, I I would agree about patient demographics and admission treatment data, but I think twenty-seven twenty-eight and twenty-seven forty-six is the 380 00:48:59.310 --> 00:49:00.660 Vlad Ladik: to be restored 381 00:49:03.140 --> 00:49:10.920 Branon Barrett: so we I mean, So, as far as as far as the people going in and manually correcting the incorrect 382 00:49:11.030 --> 00:49:19.859 Branon Barrett: data uh submissions we we have. We'll have a list of patient Ids so we could. We could not include those in the 383 00:49:20.180 --> 00:49:23.870 Branon Barrett: and the uh reapply if that's 384 00:49:24.510 --> 00:49:26.069 Branon Barrett: uh concern. 385 00:49:35.560 --> 00:49:54.590 Geraldine Bojarski: Oh, sorry! Was that talking on mute. No, no, we heard you. Okay, this is this is Geraldine. I just want to make sure. So we should tell the clinics not to do anything further in the system until they're told. But you are not going to wipe out any new 386 00:49:54.600 --> 00:49:59.730 Geraldine Bojarski: admissions that were entered manually By the user Is that correct? 387 00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:05.000 Chris Brown: That's what he said, but I think we should, 388 00:50:05.530 --> 00:50:10.400 Chris Brown: because if they were correcting something that was inadvertently broken. With this bad data, 389 00:50:12.460 --> 00:50:16.849 Chris Brown: it might result in something strange when this is all said and done, if we keep part of it. 390 00:50:16.990 --> 00:50:30.669 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: And this is gently with the Ncc. To support what Chris is saying is that. Um some of that clean up. Um, I understand. I heard you say that heard them say that they could identify specific 391 00:50:30.680 --> 00:50:38.569 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: patient uh eqrs ids, and not make any changes for those patients, but retaining those 392 00:50:38.780 --> 00:50:39.830 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: Um 393 00:50:40.490 --> 00:50:58.849 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: erroneously submitted data on those patients might cause uh problems with the timeliness of the data having been entered cause them to create a twenty-seven twenty-eight on a patient that never really should have been included in srd death notices other things. 394 00:50:58.860 --> 00:51:08.310 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: I'm just concerned about how the users may have reacted and tried to fix it on their end, not knowing that this was going on. 395 00:51:08.680 --> 00:51:23.060 Geraldine Bojarski: Well, Janet, this is Geraldine again. In the cases where I was talking that it happened two weeks ago. You know I was actually able to leave the Davida admission in and just go in and modify 396 00:51:23.070 --> 00:51:42.480 Geraldine Bojarski: my current system, discharge and remove it. So, in fact, you will have admissions where clinics will probably go in and remove the system, discharge, and the end date, and just continue on with that to Vita admission remaining in that patients. 397 00:51:42.490 --> 00:51:43.330 Geraldine Bojarski: Wow: 398 00:51:44.070 --> 00:51:59.710 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: Yeah, that that's what I'm: i'm just concerned about how how much of it was done in a very appropriate way and creatively, and how much of it was done with less knowledge than your users might have had, and less creatively. 399 00:52:01.780 --> 00:52:21.239 Kathleen Prewitt: So I mean, yeah, I don't disagree with all that. But the reason I ask the question right is because right now my team is trying to do august clinical data, or it closes right, which includes manually entering admissions that that couldn't get through. 400 00:52:21.320 --> 00:52:37.490 Kathleen Prewitt: And if you know, we reset the system to prior right and wipe out those admissions. We have to go back and redo them, and depending on how long this is going to take. That is 401 00:52:37.500 --> 00:52:56.519 Kathleen Prewitt: a smaller and smaller window for us to get august data in, especially the clinical data submission issues that are going on right now with Batch and Ui. So I guess all long story short, are we also considering some sort of extension on clinical data with both of these issues 402 00:52:56.530 --> 00:52:57.820 Kathleen Prewitt: in the system, 403 00:53:00.160 --> 00:53:05.749 LISA REES: There's nobody from Qu on the call. I don't think so. That question can't be answered. 404 00:53:13.260 --> 00:53:15.040 Nathan Muzos: And Kurt 405 00:53:15.090 --> 00:53:16.669 Nathan Muzos: Let's say we 406 00:53:17.860 --> 00:53:19.540 Nathan Muzos: come up with a plan 407 00:53:19.780 --> 00:53:26.680 Nathan Muzos: uh you will come up with a plan, right? But I mean, what sort of timeframe 408 00:53:27.200 --> 00:53:31.180 Nathan Muzos: do you have any idea what sort of timeframe if we decide to roll back to Saturday. 409 00:53:32.940 --> 00:53:36.660 Nathan Muzos: Is that something that would be done like tomorrow? 410 00:53:37.190 --> 00:53:42.610 Nathan Muzos: Is it next week? Yeah, Do you have any range of that kind of so turn around? 411 00:53:42.630 --> 00:53:57.440 Curtis Phillips: So I guess the short answer is, you know I want to do it as soon as possible, but I also want to give the team a chance to put the plan together and make sure we communicated well to everyone, and everyone can react to it. Um, 412 00:53:57.450 --> 00:54:16.920 Curtis Phillips: I I think that um, you know by no later than the close of business today. I want to try to at least have the plan and be able to respond to that question. I I just don't know yet what the what the work is and what the timing is. So we need to. We really need to be careful. We need to use a lot of care here, and what we're doing. 413 00:54:16.950 --> 00:54:18.069 Curtis Phillips: Um: 414 00:54:19.190 --> 00:54:22.949 Curtis Phillips: So um yeah, I mean, 415 00:54:23.320 --> 00:54:34.059 Curtis Phillips: I know Brandon, Did you have any? Can you add anything to that I mean, I think we really I I mean i'm moving forward at this point. I i'm heard anyone um 416 00:54:34.820 --> 00:54:41.369 Curtis Phillips: really give me any negative feedback about rolling back. I think it's the you know. I think it's the the 417 00:54:41.630 --> 00:54:43.690 Curtis Phillips: the least risk 418 00:54:43.820 --> 00:55:03.400 Curtis Phillips: um to all this from a date of from a data quality. Um perspective. So i'm really planning on going going down the the um rollback per approach. Um, So i'm gonna ask the team to put together a plan. And um. Once we have that together we'll share it, and then we'll 419 00:55:03.410 --> 00:55:05.600 Curtis Phillips: what the timeline needs to be. 420 00:55:07.100 --> 00:55:21.130 Branon Barrett: I I I think the only outstanding question on on the plan that that I need, Kurt is is the user enter data. Um, 421 00:55:21.160 --> 00:55:24.940 Branon Barrett: You know the decision to to reapply user in and data or not. 422 00:55:26.570 --> 00:55:32.300 Curtis Phillips: Yeah, that's a that's you know. I've heard both sides of that story. Um, 423 00:55:32.550 --> 00:55:33.729 Curtis Phillips: um 424 00:55:34.370 --> 00:55:37.850 Curtis Phillips: in the case where they might be fixing something 425 00:55:38.120 --> 00:55:55.689 Curtis Phillips: um that they believed was an error. Um, that it that they shouldn't have really fixed. That's the one case that I heard uh, and the second is from Kathleen, who's trying to get um data into the system has been putting data into the system. Um, 426 00:55:55.700 --> 00:56:05.540 Curtis Phillips: that they know is, you know, is is is valid. You know that data would have to be re-entered. I mean, those are, I think I do. I understand the two scenarios. 427 00:56:08.230 --> 00:56:10.790 Curtis Phillips: Do I have it right? Can someone? 428 00:56:11.300 --> 00:56:15.450 Janet Lea Hutchinson - NCC: I think you do. I think that's both ends of the spectrum. 429 00:56:15.640 --> 00:56:20.349 Dan Kayhart: Yeah. And the third piece of it is that we do have the ability to 430 00:56:20.570 --> 00:56:25.740 Dan Kayhart: reapply. The manually entered data only for patients that 431 00:56:25.930 --> 00:56:30.410 Dan Kayhart: are not matching with the list of patients that we know had bad data. 432 00:56:30.700 --> 00:56:34.110 Dan Kayhart: So yeah, if if it helps, 433 00:56:34.380 --> 00:56:35.839 Dan Kayhart: you can kind of 434 00:56:36.700 --> 00:56:40.559 Dan Kayhart: can kind of do both by. You know, 435 00:56:40.790 --> 00:56:44.560 Dan Kayhart: ui changes that are for patients that weren't part of the 436 00:56:44.940 --> 00:56:47.069 Dan Kayhart: of the bad data batch 437 00:56:47.250 --> 00:56:48.310 Dan Kayhart: that 438 00:56:48.720 --> 00:57:00.709 Curtis Phillips: uh, we can take the changes for those folks. And then so Dan pause there, real quick. So that's that's essentially taking, taking care of um. 439 00:57:01.800 --> 00:57:05.149 Curtis Phillips: That's essentially taking care of the 440 00:57:05.280 --> 00:57:12.099 Curtis Phillips: data that was being entered for August. I'm sorry, August, for um. Is that right for August? 441 00:57:12.230 --> 00:57:13.080 Kathleen Prewitt: Yes. 442 00:57:13.910 --> 00:57:16.869 Curtis Phillips: So, Kathryn, I think we can. 443 00:57:17.240 --> 00:57:21.649 Curtis Phillips: We can limit the impact to you. I think that's what Dan is saying. Right? Dan: 444 00:57:21.680 --> 00:57:35.169 Dan Kayhart: Yeah, attempting to. So yeah, I mean, we have the list of patients right that were affected um with with the the the backs that went through this weekend, so 445 00:57:35.590 --> 00:57:38.079 Dan Kayhart: we can be careful not to 446 00:57:39.280 --> 00:57:42.580 Dan Kayhart: when we revert, will only reapply 447 00:57:42.840 --> 00:57:50.929 Dan Kayhart: manually enter data for patients that weren't included in that batch. And then those that were can be identified. And we can, 448 00:57:52.510 --> 00:57:57.510 Dan Kayhart: you know, handle those cases which hopefully it won't be a lot. 449 00:57:57.560 --> 00:57:58.399 Yeah, 450 00:58:00.090 --> 00:58:03.289 Dan Kayhart: Is that is that making sense, Brandon? 451 00:58:06.210 --> 00:58:17.459 Branon Barrett: Yeah. I mean that that was that was my idea. I think I heard. I think we heard some concern that that there may be an intended impacts even of that. Um! 452 00:58:18.450 --> 00:58:21.039 LISA REES: What are we saying that 453 00:58:21.420 --> 00:58:27.479 LISA REES: the independent facilities that have been affected by the Us. 454 00:58:29.020 --> 00:58:33.979 LISA REES: We will contact them and have them re-enter the data, then 455 00:58:37.810 --> 00:58:44.460 Chris Brown: I think only if i'm reading Dan and Brandon right only if those patient ids were included in this bad 456 00:58:44.560 --> 00:58:45.580 Chris Brown: data. 457 00:58:46.130 --> 00:58:50.590 Dan Kayhart: Yeah. So basically, in the end we've come up with a list of 458 00:58:51.030 --> 00:58:56.799 Dan Kayhart: Ui changes for patients that were part of the 459 00:58:57.100 --> 00:58:59.290 Dan Kayhart: the that 460 00:59:00.550 --> 00:59:09.060 Dan Kayhart: so that could potentially have bad data where we know that. Oh, that might potentially be our correction, so to speak, 461 00:59:09.070 --> 00:59:28.850 Curtis Phillips: of the data that was made manually right. But it might. They might not have to do anything if they made the they were correcting something that really didn't need to be corrected. But Kathleen's data would be re would be um restored, and she wouldn't need to re-enter that data. But the people that are told 462 00:59:28.860 --> 00:59:34.799 Curtis Phillips: um those those patient ids that were included in the you know, that are in question. 463 00:59:34.980 --> 00:59:52.950 Curtis Phillips: Those facilities would have to look at that um entry and say, Gee, that makes sense. We don't need to redo that because it was, you know the data was was invalid, or maybe they do, if it was really valid. I don't know. 464 00:59:52.960 --> 01:00:10.499 Dan Kayhart: So they would have to tell us. It's okay to put that in or no don't put that in, or they just go ahead and do it. Yeah, At that point I would say at that point I would say, Um, they will. We'll turn it over to them and let them do it 465 01:00:11.150 --> 01:00:16.070 Curtis Phillips: unless it's a large large volume, and so we have to to sort that out. But 466 01:00:20.070 --> 01:00:25.389 Vlad Ladik: all right, it can. You share with us list of upis 467 01:00:27.030 --> 01:00:28.450 Vlad Ladik: that effective 468 01:00:31.300 --> 01:00:36.310 Branon Barrett: Um, we're still we're. We're gathering that from our side. Um, 469 01:00:38.690 --> 01:00:46.730 Branon Barrett: I I don't know if uh if from the debit side you guys have that list already. But we're We're working on it, too. 470 01:00:46.830 --> 01:00:50.439 Curtis Phillips: So 471 01:00:51.470 --> 01:00:52.330 yeah, 472 01:00:52.460 --> 01:00:59.910 Curtis Phillips: the Vita was working on. I'm: sorry. Go ahead. You were working on coming up with the list, Right? 473 01:01:00.450 --> 01:01:05.309 SFILLING: Yep. Yep. We received some criteria from from Nathan, and we're We're pulling that list right now. 474 01:01:05.500 --> 01:01:06.509 Curtis Phillips: Okay, 475 01:01:06.850 --> 01:01:10.520 Vlad Ladik: Because then we we can take care of our own clinics. 476 01:01:11.360 --> 01:01:13.050 Vlad Ladik: So you don't need to, 477 01:01:15.290 --> 01:01:22.409 Vlad Ladik: because we know what we submitted. And so we can. We can let our clinics know uh 478 01:01:22.620 --> 01:01:24.660 Vlad Ladik: about those patients. 479 01:01:28.280 --> 01:01:32.930 Curtis Phillips: So, Sarah: Yeah, we're We're kind of anxiously waiting on that list. 480 01:01:34.680 --> 01:01:37.660 SFILLING: We'll get it to you as soon as possible. It's our top priority. 481 01:01:37.690 --> 01:01:39.259 Curtis Phillips: Okay, thank you 482 01:01:39.640 --> 01:01:53.869 Chris Brown: and I would just offer to Dan and and Brandon, based on the numbers that Janet saw that Vita saw that I saw this morning. It seems like the Delta. After this is all done will be very small. So, rather than trying to contact every mom and pop facility 483 01:01:53.880 --> 01:02:01.549 Chris Brown: in the country to say, Hey, you might want to look at this patient to see if you want to re-enter that admission. Maybe send them to the network. It's going to be a small number for us to get through. 484 01:02:02.210 --> 01:02:08.269 Dan Kayhart: Oh, perfect! I like that. I like that approach. 485 01:02:08.590 --> 01:02:11.560 Chris Brown: Why wouldn't I right, Chris? 486 01:02:11.760 --> 01:02:30.970 Geraldine Bojarski: And then and then this is Geraldine after the clean up um, after we've done all the clean up. If the clinics still end up having an admission in their patience file that is erroneous. Um! They should just call the network and have the network delete that one one like one or two. 487 01:02:31.490 --> 01:02:36.530 Chris Brown: Yeah, I I think that's appropriate like, I said, I think it's going to be small numbers when this is all said and done. 488 01:02:41.250 --> 01:02:50.409 Curtis Phillips: So i'm Just curious is everyone throttled back their um patient submissions at this point, or is everyone kind of stopped? Everything 489 01:02:55.610 --> 01:02:57.089 Nathan Muzos: I know we have. 490 01:02:57.260 --> 01:02:59.720 Nathan Muzos: We're not. We're not submitting anything 491 01:03:00.220 --> 01:03:02.410 Nathan Muzos: for right now 492 01:03:10.690 --> 01:03:14.390 Kathleen Prewitt: we have. 493 01:03:15.000 --> 01:03:23.410 Vlad Ladik: Dci has next submission on Friday, so we can. We can stop it if needed. 494 01:03:26.850 --> 01:03:28.040 Curtis Phillips: All right, 495 01:03:29.280 --> 01:03:34.129 Curtis Phillips: does anyone? And I mean, anyone does anyone have any questions? Um, 496 01:03:34.460 --> 01:03:36.720 Curtis Phillips: we're We're already a time. 497 01:03:36.860 --> 01:03:42.000 Curtis Phillips: So we used up your your hour at least. I apologize. Um. But, uh, 498 01:03:42.570 --> 01:03:47.520 Curtis Phillips: is there anything else anyone wants to raise any questions or concerns. 499 01:03:57.180 --> 01:04:10.439 Curtis Phillips: All right, guys. Uh, like, I say, we're gonna We're going to uh endeavor to put together a plan. Um! And as soon as we have that, together with the with the timetables. Um, we will. 500 01:04:10.770 --> 01:04:13.259 Curtis Phillips: We will communicate back to you. 501 01:04:16.520 --> 01:04:24.250 LISA REES: So, since we use this time for a different purpose. Is there a day 502 01:04:24.320 --> 01:04:26.129 LISA REES: next week. 503 01:04:26.370 --> 01:04:28.000 LISA REES: That 504 01:04:28.170 --> 01:04:31.589 LISA REES: would be good for y'all to have 505 01:04:31.890 --> 01:04:34.709 LISA REES: the discussion around Peritinnatus. 506 01:04:49.200 --> 01:04:59.300 Nathan Muzos: What if we just did our normal Wednesday? I know it's a week where we don't have our normal Wednesday call. 507 01:04:59.770 --> 01:05:00.720 Vlad Ladik: Okay, 508 01:05:01.210 --> 01:05:17.319 Vlad Ladik: and I, Paula, please give my apologies to all of your physicians. We were planning to be here today. No problem. So thank you.